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Home > Archive > IIS and SMTP > March 2005 > Mail is never delivered instantly to yahoo.com
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| Author |
Mail is never delivered instantly to yahoo.com
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| Incoming Emails setup:
We have a smtp server (win2003/IIS) in DMZ (Nat'ed using a public IP) which
accepts all emails from the Internet for our domain for example xyz.com and
delivers all that email to our exchange 2003 server (inside network). All is
well here.
Outgoing Emails setup:
Exchange 2003 forwards all outgoing emails to the same SMTP server in DMZ,
which delivers mail to all Internet sites.
Problem:
Emails written to ANY domain is delivered instantly.
For example mails to gmail.com, hotmail.com, anything.com is delivered
instantly.
But if the to/cc/bcc address contains a yahoo.com address, bingo, that email
just sits there in queue directory.
Things that happen:
The mail gets delivered at yahoo.com either after 20 mins, sometimes it
takes more than an hour. Sometimes it simply does not get delivered. If I
restart the SMTP service, the mail DOES get delivered.
Server in DMZ is allowed all outgoing TCP/UDP connections. So there is no
issue with any firewall setting too. Queue directory always has some or the
other junk mail sitting there, as usual containing emails to be delivered to
phony addresses. But this directory is auto cleaned by smtp server, i guess
by smtp service.
Can someone help please? Our users have customers who have yahoo.com
addresses and this is causing a lot of pain.
Thanks
Dilip
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| Peter D. Hipson 2005-03-27, 5:54 pm |
| This is not authorative... But...
I've seen similar problems with Yahoo emails in teh past as well. It
seems to take (sometimes) hours to get an email through to them, and
sometimes it never happens. It is a Yahoo problem, not your problem
and not mine, and not some others who have seen the same thing happen.
What is happeing is that for some reason Yahoo is not accepting the
email on the first try. It (the email) goes back into the queue for
later delivery. There is a schedule for retries that progressively
lengthens the delay between retries with each failure, until a given
time has passed (this can be configured!) and once the total limit
passes, the email is supposed to bounc back to the user.
I found that if I shortened the length of time between retries
substantially that most Yahoo mails go through on the second or third
try. I suspect it is their server being overloaded, but can't say for
sure.
On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 05:51:02 -0800, "Dilip"
<Dilip@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:
>Incoming Emails setup:
>We have a smtp server (win2003/IIS) in DMZ (Nat'ed using a public IP) which
>accepts all emails from the Internet for our domain for example xyz.com and
>delivers all that email to our exchange 2003 server (inside network). All is
>well here.
>
>Outgoing Emails setup:
>Exchange 2003 forwards all outgoing emails to the same SMTP server in DMZ,
>which delivers mail to all Internet sites.
>
>Problem:
>Emails written to ANY domain is delivered instantly.
>For example mails to gmail.com, hotmail.com, anything.com is delivered
>instantly.
>But if the to/cc/bcc address contains a yahoo.com address, bingo, that email
>just sits there in queue directory.
>
>Things that happen:
>The mail gets delivered at yahoo.com either after 20 mins, sometimes it
>takes more than an hour. Sometimes it simply does not get delivered. If I
>restart the SMTP service, the mail DOES get delivered.
>
>Server in DMZ is allowed all outgoing TCP/UDP connections. So there is no
>issue with any firewall setting too. Queue directory always has some or the
>other junk mail sitting there, as usual containing emails to be delivered to
>phony addresses. But this directory is auto cleaned by smtp server, i guess
>by smtp service.
>
>Can someone help please? Our users have customers who have yahoo.com
>addresses and this is causing a lot of pain.
>
>Thanks
>Dilip
PeterD, the Darkstar Network
To email, fix my address!
ExpertZone!
| |
| Jeff Cochran 2005-03-27, 5:54 pm |
| On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 05:51:02 -0800, "Dilip"
<Dilip@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:
>Incoming Emails setup:
>We have a smtp server (win2003/IIS) in DMZ (Nat'ed using a public IP) which
>accepts all emails from the Internet for our domain for example xyz.com and
>delivers all that email to our exchange 2003 server (inside network). All is
>well here.
>
>Outgoing Emails setup:
>Exchange 2003 forwards all outgoing emails to the same SMTP server in DMZ,
>which delivers mail to all Internet sites.
>
>Problem:
>Emails written to ANY domain is delivered instantly.
>For example mails to gmail.com, hotmail.com, anything.com is delivered
>instantly.
>But if the to/cc/bcc address contains a yahoo.com address, bingo, that email
>just sits there in queue directory.
>
>Things that happen:
>The mail gets delivered at yahoo.com either after 20 mins, sometimes it
>takes more than an hour. Sometimes it simply does not get delivered. If I
>restart the SMTP service, the mail DOES get delivered.
>
>Server in DMZ is allowed all outgoing TCP/UDP connections. So there is no
>issue with any firewall setting too. Queue directory always has some or the
>other junk mail sitting there, as usual containing emails to be delivered to
>phony addresses. But this directory is auto cleaned by smtp server, i guess
>by smtp service.
>
>Can someone help please? Our users have customers who have yahoo.com
>addresses and this is causing a lot of pain.
FWIW, I see the same behavior on non-Microsoft SMTP servers as well.
Yahoo just doesn't make the connection on about half the attempts.
Miss two or three attempts and the retries start taking hours.
Jeff
| |
|
| Thanks Peter and Jeff for the reply.
But do you have any suggestions, like a configuration change or some
customised tool that you may know. Retry settings seems to be the first thing
that I should tweak.
Meanwhile I am going to speak with someone at Yahoo! tomorrow morning.
I hope that I am able to speak with someone from Yahoo!
I have heard that their support is real bad.
"Dilip" wrote:
> Incoming Emails setup:
> We have a smtp server (win2003/IIS) in DMZ (Nat'ed using a public IP) which
> accepts all emails from the Internet for our domain for example xyz.com and
> delivers all that email to our exchange 2003 server (inside network). All is
> well here.
>
> Outgoing Emails setup:
> Exchange 2003 forwards all outgoing emails to the same SMTP server in DMZ,
> which delivers mail to all Internet sites.
>
> Problem:
> Emails written to ANY domain is delivered instantly.
> For example mails to gmail.com, hotmail.com, anything.com is delivered
> instantly.
> But if the to/cc/bcc address contains a yahoo.com address, bingo, that email
> just sits there in queue directory.
>
> Things that happen:
> The mail gets delivered at yahoo.com either after 20 mins, sometimes it
> takes more than an hour. Sometimes it simply does not get delivered. If I
> restart the SMTP service, the mail DOES get delivered.
>
> Server in DMZ is allowed all outgoing TCP/UDP connections. So there is no
> issue with any firewall setting too. Queue directory always has some or the
> other junk mail sitting there, as usual containing emails to be delivered to
> phony addresses. But this directory is auto cleaned by smtp server, i guess
> by smtp service.
>
> Can someone help please? Our users have customers who have yahoo.com
> addresses and this is causing a lot of pain.
>
> Thanks
> Dilip
>
| |
| Peter D. Hipson 2005-03-28, 6:18 pm |
| No one at Yahoo who knows anythign at all will speak to you! <g> They
are too busy fixing the email system... The customer support person
will tell you everythign is OK, it is your problem. Stock answer.
Fix: Yes, I reduced the retry time out period substantiallly. This
made for more retries in a shorter period of time. Eventually the
email will go through, not usually the first time.
BTW, both receiving and sending at Yahoo are "broken", my agent uses
Yahoo and sometimes his emails to me are four or more hours old.
On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 17:41:03 -0800, "Dilip"
<Dilip@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:
>Thanks Peter and Jeff for the reply.
>But do you have any suggestions, like a configuration change or some
>customised tool that you may know. Retry settings seems to be the first thing
>that I should tweak.
>
>Meanwhile I am going to speak with someone at Yahoo! tomorrow morning.
>I hope that I am able to speak with someone from Yahoo!
>I have heard that their support is real bad.
>
PeterD, the Darkstar Network
To email, fix my address!
ExpertZone!
| |
|
| Thanks for the reply.
I will fix the retry settings.
I will update soon....
"Peter D. Hipson" wrote:
> No one at Yahoo who knows anythign at all will speak to you! <g> They
> are too busy fixing the email system... The customer support person
> will tell you everythign is OK, it is your problem. Stock answer.
>
> Fix: Yes, I reduced the retry time out period substantiallly. This
> made for more retries in a shorter period of time. Eventually the
> email will go through, not usually the first time.
>
> BTW, both receiving and sending at Yahoo are "broken", my agent uses
> Yahoo and sometimes his emails to me are four or more hours old.
>
> On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 17:41:03 -0800, "Dilip"
> <Dilip@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:
>
>
> PeterD, the Darkstar Network
> To email, fix my address!
> ExpertZone!
>
| |
| Jeff Cochran 2005-03-28, 6:18 pm |
| On Mon, 28 Mar 2005 09:27:45 -0500, Peter D. Hipson <mcn01 at hipson
dot net> wrote:
>No one at Yahoo who knows anythign at all will speak to you! <g> They
>are too busy fixing the email system... The customer support person
>will tell you everythign is OK, it is your problem. Stock answer.
>
>Fix: Yes, I reduced the retry time out period substantiallly. This
>made for more retries in a shorter period of time. Eventually the
>email will go through, not usually the first time.
>
>BTW, both receiving and sending at Yahoo are "broken", my agent uses
>Yahoo and sometimes his emails to me are four or more hours old.
Welcome to the world of email. 
Personally, my system works properly so I refuse to adapt it to
outside systems that don't. Mail is late for Yahoo users. We just
tell people not to use a Yahoo account, or if they do, to expect mail
delivery to take longer.
Jeff
>
>On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 17:41:03 -0800, "Dilip"
><Dilip@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:
>
>
>PeterD, the Darkstar Network
>To email, fix my address!
>ExpertZone!
| |
|
| I agree with you Jeff.
But users are users, they just panic.
They will always think that the local network is always the issue.
It will take sometime for me to convince users that hey "We are not the
problem here". etc.
Anyways I changed the retry settings and now Yahoo! emails are getting
delivered.
After 5 minutes.... but... thats just fine for me as of now.
Thanks a lot you guys to help me out.
Considering this as a closed issue for now.
Cheers!
Dilip
"Jeff Cochran" wrote:
> On Mon, 28 Mar 2005 09:27:45 -0500, Peter D. Hipson <mcn01 at hipson
> dot net> wrote:
>
>
> Welcome to the world of email.
>
> Personally, my system works properly so I refuse to adapt it to
> outside systems that don't. Mail is late for Yahoo users. We just
> tell people not to use a Yahoo account, or if they do, to expect mail
> delivery to take longer.
>
> Jeff
>
>
>
| |
|
| This is reply I received from YAHOO.
Is there any way I can provide them detailed logs on an SMTP conversation
from my IIS SMTP service to their YAHOO ysmtp service?
Hello,
Thank you for contacting Yahoo! Customer Care.
Without any specific SMTP error message, we are unable to effectively
troubleshoot the issue.
Occasionally, interruptions or disruptions in email transmissions over
the Internet will render a message undeliverable. While this is very
rare, it does happen. If you continue to experience this delivery issue,
in order to troubleshoot it, we would appreciate it if you could provide
a full SMTP thread that represents the connection that resulted in the
delivery failure. Please provide:
* The output of a manual SMTP test (typically with telnet) from your
mail server to our servers showing the SMTP conversation leading up to
and including the rejection message.
* Log messages from your mail server showing which IP you connected to
and what responses you got from the remote server at the time you
received the failures.
Again, we appreciate your assistance and apologize for any
inconvenience.
Thank you again for contacting Yahoo! Customer Care.
Regards,
Sergio
Yahoo! Customer Care - Mail Investigations
"Jeff Cochran" wrote:
> On Mon, 28 Mar 2005 09:27:45 -0500, Peter D. Hipson <mcn01 at hipson
> dot net> wrote:
>
>
> Welcome to the world of email.
>
> Personally, my system works properly so I refuse to adapt it to
> outside systems that don't. Mail is late for Yahoo users. We just
> tell people not to use a Yahoo account, or if they do, to expect mail
> delivery to take longer.
>
> Jeff
>
>
>
| |
| Phillip Vong 2005-03-30, 5:58 pm |
| They might be using some form of Greylisting. We're using Greylisting here
so my server will always send an email back to say try later if I don't know
you.
Phil
"Dilip" <Dilip@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:0A9E5824-D203-482F-9C89-53554292BB32@microsoft.com...
> Incoming Emails setup:
> We have a smtp server (win2003/IIS) in DMZ (Nat'ed using a public IP)
> which
> accepts all emails from the Internet for our domain for example xyz.com
> and
> delivers all that email to our exchange 2003 server (inside network). All
> is
> well here.
>
> Outgoing Emails setup:
> Exchange 2003 forwards all outgoing emails to the same SMTP server in DMZ,
> which delivers mail to all Internet sites.
>
> Problem:
> Emails written to ANY domain is delivered instantly.
> For example mails to gmail.com, hotmail.com, anything.com is delivered
> instantly.
> But if the to/cc/bcc address contains a yahoo.com address, bingo, that
> email
> just sits there in queue directory.
>
> Things that happen:
> The mail gets delivered at yahoo.com either after 20 mins, sometimes it
> takes more than an hour. Sometimes it simply does not get delivered. If I
> restart the SMTP service, the mail DOES get delivered.
>
> Server in DMZ is allowed all outgoing TCP/UDP connections. So there is no
> issue with any firewall setting too. Queue directory always has some or
> the
> other junk mail sitting there, as usual containing emails to be delivered
> to
> phony addresses. But this directory is auto cleaned by smtp server, i
> guess
> by smtp service.
>
> Can someone help please? Our users have customers who have yahoo.com
> addresses and this is causing a lot of pain.
>
> Thanks
> Dilip
>
| |
|
| I guess so. But atleast now, after changing the retry settings to 5, 15, 30,
60, 60, the emails DO get delivered.
I am happy.
Now I surely want to say one thing - Yahoo! sucks!
They should remove that exclamation mark from their trademark. Really.
Anyways thanks to you all for giving me the right help.
Bye
"Phillip Vong" wrote:
> They might be using some form of Greylisting. We're using Greylisting here
> so my server will always send an email back to say try later if I don't know
> you.
>
> Phil
>
> "Dilip" <Dilip@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
> news:0A9E5824-D203-482F-9C89-53554292BB32@microsoft.com...
>
>
>
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