|
Home > Archive > Anonymous Servers > January 2006 > Greet all... what's up with the remailers ?
You are viewing an archived Text-only version of the thread.
To view this thread in it's original format and/or if you want to reply to
this thread please [click here]
| Author |
Greet all... what's up with the remailers ?
|
|
| STEALTH 2006-01-13, 9:22 pm |
| Hey all, I was just wondering... what's up with the remailers these days?
Either it's my client config (JBN) or the remailers but somethings up.
Seems pretty hard to get a message through these days. MM or CP.
Back in or around 2000 when we were doing some tests and I was running
Stealth RM, a few of us could get a message through 15 remailers (CP),
and I believe (acording to him) that another guy chained a message through 18.
(see threads)
http://groups.google.com/group/alt....aed0944ea435f97
http://groups.google.com/group/alt....2143c086989adc1
Anyway, what the hell... now I can't seem to get through two with any reliability.
What gives? I've been out of the scene for a while so... Is it a remailer problem?
Any info appreciated.
Former Stealth Admin
| |
| George Orwell 2006-01-14, 2:46 am |
| STEALTH wrote:
> Anyway, what the hell... now I can't seem to get through two with any
> reliability. What gives? I've been out of the scene for a while so... Is
> it a remailer problem? Any info appreciated.
>
> Former Stealth Admin
Hey! I remember a remailer named "stealth". Don't remember much about it
except for the mane though right now. 
Anyway, I think that the smaller number of remailers and general
"atmosphere" these days forces us to give up a bit of security for
reliability. I have nearly 100% successful deliveries to Usenet, but I'm
using a scripted selection for chains of 5 or 6 remailers, with some
completely random selections, some specific remailers in specific spots
(to counter the Winston Smith problem), and exit remailers chosen only
from a pool of between 3 and 7 typically.
IOW, at this point Mixmaster is more of a MTA than anything else. I still
let SOME random choices be made right from the stats by Mixmaster, but I
feed it a good bit of preselected stuff as well.
| |
| Tom Payne 2006-01-14, 7:46 am |
| On Fri, 13 Jan 2006 21:35:47 -0500, STEALTH <Stealth@Hooya.com> wrote:
>Hey all, I was just wondering... what's up with the remailers these days?
>Either it's my client config (JBN) or the remailers but somethings up.
>Seems pretty hard to get a message through these days. MM or CP.
>
>Back in or around 2000 when we were doing some tests and I was running
>Stealth RM, a few of us could get a message through 15 remailers (CP),
>and I believe (acording to him) that another guy chained a message through 18.
>(see threads)
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt....aed0944ea435f97
>
>http://groups.google.com/group/alt....2143c086989adc1
>
>Anyway, what the hell... now I can't seem to get through two with any reliability.
>What gives? I've been out of the scene for a while so... Is it a remailer problem?
>Any info appreciated.
>
>Former Stealth Admin
Gee, it must be you, I always use a chain of 20, no less and
no more with 3 copies and they almost always get through 95%. Check
your settings.
| |
| Tom Payne 2006-01-14, 7:46 am |
| On Sat, 14 Jan 2006 04:36:16 +0100 (CET), George Orwell
<nobody@mixmaster.it> wrote:
>STEALTH wrote:
>
>
>Hey! I remember a remailer named "stealth". Don't remember much about it
>except for the mane though right now.
>
>Anyway, I think that the smaller number of remailers and general
>"atmosphere" these days forces us to give up a bit of security for
>reliability. I have nearly 100% successful deliveries to Usenet, but I'm
>using a scripted selection for chains of 5 or 6 remailers, with some
>completely random selections, some specific remailers in specific spots
>(to counter the Winston Smith problem), and exit remailers chosen only
>from a pool of between 3 and 7 typically.
>
>IOW, at this point Mixmaster is more of a MTA than anything else. I still
>let SOME random choices be made right from the stats by Mixmaster, but I
>feed it a good bit of preselected stuff as well.
>
What is the winston smith problem?
| |
|
| On Sat, 14 Jan 2006 03:37:53 -0800, Tom Payne wrote in
Message-Id: <hjohs1dkqbf2bo3iadj65gt8soutja1nje@4ax.com>:
> What is the winston smith problem?
There isn't a problem. Winston Smith is the name of an organisation
where some participants run remailers. There was some misunderstanding
that all the nodes were run by the same person. This has been clarified
now and everyone is happy.
--
pub 1024D/8ED57743 2003-07-08 Bananasplit Operator
Key fingerprint = 796F 67E0 E890 A0BB BDAE EBB4 94A6 7A09 8ED5 7743
uid Admin <admin.bananasplit.info>
| |
| Anonymous 2006-01-14, 7:46 am |
| In article <25ogs15gutc6oht0e1fu9snsnm4pajo555@4ax.com>
STEALTH <Stealth@Hooya.com> wrote:
>
> Hey all, I was just wondering... what's up with the remailers these days?
> Either it's my client config (JBN) or the remailers but somethings up.
> Seems pretty hard to get a message through these days. MM or CP.
>
> Back in or around 2000 when we were doing some tests and I was running
> Stealth RM, a few of us could get a message through 15 remailers (CP),
> and I believe (acording to him) that another guy chained a message through 18.
> (see threads)
> http://groups.google.com/group/alt....aed0944ea435f97
>
> http://groups.google.com/group/alt....2143c086989adc1
>
> Anyway, what the hell... now I can't seem to get through two with any reliability.
> What gives? I've been out of the scene for a while so... Is it a remailer problem?
> Any info appreciated.
>
> Former Stealth Admin
If you have problems getting it through just two remailers, there must
be some sort of problem. Although I don't do it often, I have sent
messages through chains of 20 remailers and none of them have vanished.
There's a couple of things to check:
Make sure your stats source is a good one, and lists Broken Chain
information. What with certain mail hosts blocking mail from dynamic ips
and dns block lists, sometimes a remailer can't connect to another
remailer. A stats source with Broken Chain information allows your
client to avoid those situations. Bananasplit pinger at
http://pinger.bananasplit.info is a good reliable stats source.
A few remailers block usenet completely, and a few others may have
difficulty connecting to one or more of the mail2news servers. If you
are attempting to send with those remailers as the exit, your message
will mysteriously vanish into thin air. Have a look here:
http://www.cotse.net/users/drsnoid/results.txt
and http://www.cotse.net/users/drsnoid/results.gif
If you are attempting to use Cpunk remailers, which I wouldn't recommend
these days, make sure the remailers you are using have up to date keys
for the other remailers. Messages travelling through your chain will
be remixed into a mixmaster message between hops, and if the remailer
that remixed your message didn't have the correct keys for the next
remailer, your message will vanish.
Make sure your exit remailer doesn't block the newsgroup you are
attempting to send to. http://beta-stats.bananasplit.info/blocks.html
Off the top of my head, that's about it. Make sure you use a good stats
source (it makes all the difference), choose your exit remailer manually
so you don't get a random one chosen that blocks usenet, use mixmaster
messages instead of cpunk, and make sure your exit remailer doesn't
block the group.
| |
| Anonymous 2006-01-14, 5:46 pm |
| On Sat, 14 Jan 2006 04:36:16 +0100, George Orwell wrote:
> STEALTH wrote:
>
>
> Hey! I remember a remailer named "stealth". Don't remember much about it
> except for the mane though right now.
>
> Anyway, I think that the smaller number of remailers and general
> "atmosphere" these days forces us to give up a bit of security for
> reliability. I have nearly 100% successful deliveries to Usenet, but I'm
> using a scripted selection
Care to share your script?
> for chains of 5 or 6 remailers, with some
> completely random selections, some specific remailers in specific spots
> (to counter the Winston Smith problem), and exit remailers chosen only
> from a pool of between 3 and 7 typically.
>
> IOW, at this point Mixmaster is more of a MTA than anything else. I still
> let SOME random choices be made right from the stats by Mixmaster, but I
> feed it a good bit of preselected stuff as well.
-=-
This message was sent via two or more anonymous remailing services.
| |
| STEALTH 2006-01-14, 5:46 pm |
| On Sat, 14 Jan 2006 04:36:16 +0100 (CET), George Orwell <nobody@mixmaster.it>
wrote:
>Hey! I remember a remailer named "stealth". Don't remember much about it
>except for the mane though right now.
>
>Anyway, I think that the smaller number of remailers and general
>"atmosphere" these days forces us to give up a bit of security for
>reliability. I have nearly 100% successful deliveries to Usenet, but I'm
>using a scripted selection for chains of 5 or 6 remailers, with some
>completely random selections, some specific remailers in specific spots
>(to counter the Winston Smith problem), and exit remailers chosen only
>from a pool of between 3 and 7 typically.
Was this the thing that was causing the problems with the MM remailers back in
like 2002 or 2003 or something? You couldn't use MM for jack for a while there.
Anyway, seems the problem is cleared up now whatever it was.
>
>IOW, at this point Mixmaster is more of a MTA than anything else. I still
>let SOME random choices be made right from the stats by Mixmaster, but I
>feed it a good bit of preselected stuff as well.
Very rusty in my knowledge and terminoloy these days. MTA, mail transport agent?
| |
| STEALTH 2006-01-14, 5:46 pm |
| On Sat, 14 Jan 2006 13:54:26 +0100 (CET), in alt.privacy.anon-server you wrote:
>If you have problems getting it through just two remailers, there must
>be some sort of problem. Although I don't do it often, I have sent
>messages through chains of 20 remailers and none of them have vanished.
Wow, that's pretty wild. Back in my "day," there was a huge amount of skepticism
from a number of people that I (and a couple others) had sent messages through
15 remailers.
>There's a couple of things to check:
>
>Make sure your stats source is a good one, and lists Broken Chain
>information. What with certain mail hosts blocking mail from dynamic ips
>and dns block lists, sometimes a remailer can't connect to another
>remailer. A stats source with Broken Chain information allows your
>client to avoid those situations. Bananasplit pinger at
>http://pinger.bananasplit.info is a good reliable stats source.
Hmm.. up till now I've been using for my stats and keys:
http://panta-rhei.dyndns.org/stats/stats/rlist.txt
http://panta-rhei.dyndns.org/stats/stats/rchain.txt
http://panta-rhei.dyndns.org/stats/allkeys.txt
Same for MM. I've obviously been out of the loop for a little while and am a bit
rusty. Is Panta no longer a reliable source?
>
>A few remailers block usenet completely, and a few others may have
>difficulty connecting to one or more of the mail2news servers. If you
>are attempting to send with those remailers as the exit, your message
>will mysteriously vanish into thin air. Have a look here:
>
>http://www.cotse.net/users/drsnoid/results.txt
>and http://www.cotse.net/users/drsnoid/results.gif
>
>If you are attempting to use Cpunk remailers, which I wouldn't recommend
>these days, make sure the remailers you are using have up to date keys
>for the other remailers. Messages travelling through your chain will
>be remixed into a mixmaster message between hops, and if the remailer
>that remixed your message didn't have the correct keys for the next
>remailer, your message will vanish.
>
>Make sure your exit remailer doesn't block the newsgroup you are
>attempting to send to. http://beta-stats.bananasplit.info/blocks.html
>
>Off the top of my head, that's about it. Make sure you use a good stats
>source (it makes all the difference), choose your exit remailer manually
>so you don't get a random one chosen that blocks usenet, use mixmaster
>messages instead of cpunk, and make sure your exit remailer doesn't
>block the group.
I remember some time back, like in '99 or 2000, there was some kind of problem
with one of the (I believe it was) "pointer" .config or .dat files in JBN. I had
a hell of a time getting messages through using the old file. And then when
someone (maybe it was potato software themselves) posted this problem and a link
to the new .config or .dat file, downloaded it and put it in JBN, all my
delivery problems magically and instantly went away. It was bliss. You could
actually chain a remailer message and be about 99% sure it would arrive, and it
almost always did.
In the meantime I will look into http://pinger.bananasplit.info
But do you think it could also be a problem like the one described above?
I appreciate all the info.
Former Stealth Admin
| |
| Borked Pseudo Mailed 2006-01-14, 5:46 pm |
| Zax wrote:
> On Sat, 14 Jan 2006 03:37:53 -0800, Tom Payne wrote in Message-Id:
> <hjohs1dkqbf2bo3iadj65gt8soutja1nje@4ax.com>:
>
>
> There isn't a problem. Winston Smith is the name of an organisation where
> some participants run remailers. There was some misunderstanding that all
> the nodes were run by the same person. This has been clarified now and
> everyone is happy.
Speak for yourself, not everyone else.
The fact of the matter is that some Winston Smith project remailers do
share the same remop, and they ALL share a common bond. If you
inadvertently select those remailers consecutively in a chain it can
potentially render your anonymity null and void. The chances of that are
slim, granted, but a complete and sudden loss of anonymity isn't the only
problem being faced. As we've found out in the past, a remop who controls
two remailers has a much easier job of performing traffic analysis and
isolating/outing an alleged "abuser".
The remailer network relies on its diversity of operators. When a
"conglomerate" owns multiple remailers that diversity is measurably less
and those commonly owned remailers have a significant amount of power
that's in opposition to the design and function of the network. That's not
to impugn any WS operator, they're probably stand up people. But trusting
unknown persons isn't what the remailer network is about, now is it. ;)
It's my FIRM opinion that multiple remailers under the same umbrella is
something that needs to be considered if you're serious about your
anonymity. Making sure remailers outside that "cluster" appear in between
those remailers is only prudent. At the very least, "non-cluster"
remailers should be inserted at strategic points in your chain so that no
two "related" remailers are consecutive.
| |
| Anonymous via the Cypherpunks Tonga Remailer 2006-01-16, 2:46 am |
| TwistyCreek <anon@comments.header> wrote:
> What in the world were the designers of mixmaster thinking when they came
> up with the idea of ramdomly selectable chains in the first place?
They envisioned a perfect network where every chain is equal.
User-selectable chains harm anonymity in this system because they are
predictable. See the famous partioning attacks.
> The
> whole idea invites exactly the problem we're envisioning (rightly or
> wrongly) here. If TLA wants to sample a portion of the traffic going
> through the system, they just operate 3 or 4 remailers. The random chain
> idea ensures they'll get "thier share" of traffic to study.
They will receive the same share as other remailers. Random chains *are*
the least worst scenario. With hardcoded chains, your chances to chain
through all-TLA remailers can be up to 100% for *each* mail.
Who do you trust?
| |
| Anonymous 2006-01-16, 7:46 am |
| On Sat, 14 Jan 2006 16:17:02 +0100, Anonymous wrote:
> In article <25ogs15gutc6oht0e1fu9snsnm4pajo555@4ax.com> STEALTH
> <Stealth@Hooya.com> wrote:
>
> Hi, howzit going?
>
> I see no problems.
> This mix message comes to you like this:
>
> Chain: banana,*,*,*,*,*,*,*,*,*,*,*,*,*,*,*,*,*
,*,paranoia
>
> DISTANCE 2
> MINREL 97
> RELFINAL 98
> MAXLAT 90m
>
> *one* copy. I suppose it will arrive tomorrow, but hey.
>
> The network is always reliable for me.
This is banana,*,*,*,*,*,*,*,*,*,*,paranoia
one copy
| |
| starwars 2006-01-16, 7:46 am |
| -----BEGIN TYPE III ANONYMOUS MESSAGE-----
Message-type: plaintext
In <mbohs15j59k5ehe34hv3gb144v7k82aej6@4ax.com> Tom Payne <tompayne@somewhere.org> wrote:
>On Fri, 13 Jan 2006 21:35:47 -0500, STEALTH <Stealth@Hooya.com> wrote:
>
>
> Gee, it must be you, I always use a chain of 20, no less and
>no more with 3 copies and they almost always get through 95%. Check
>your settings.
>
Check that you are using current stats and keyrings. I usually used
3 or 5 chains of 6 to 20 remailers and I have 100% success posting.
These day I'm using Mixminion and mail2news gateways news.group@bigapple.yi.org
and mail2news-yyyymmdd-news.group@anon.lcs.mit.edu with 10 to 20 hops and only
the one chain with 100% success posting.
-----END TYPE III ANONYMOUS MESSAGE-----
|
|
|
|
|