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Home > Archive > Voice Over IP in UK > May 2006 > Sipgate codecs
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| googlegroups@wilsonhughes.co.uk 2006-05-13, 7:11 am |
| Hi
I am using a Dreytek Vigor 2600VG with two SIP providers. Sipgate and
Sipdiscount. I experience a lot of lost packets on my ADSL connection
(always have done and there's nothing that can be done about it). The
lost packets obviously cause some interruption and disconnections of
VOIP. At G.711A lost packets are obvious and at G.729A/B they are a
lot less obvious.
I have switched my router to G.729A/B (packet size 10ms) and the
Sipdiscount account works fine. However, each time a Sipgate call is
connected, the router switches to G.711A for the duration of the call.
It's as if Sipgate forces G.711A.
I am trying to find out a work around for this problem as I am
reluctant to change my router and everyone knows my Sipgate number.
Anyway for force G.729A/B with Sipgate?
Chris
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|
| googlegroups@wilsonhughes.co.uk wrote:
> Hi
>
> I am using a Dreytek Vigor 2600VG with two SIP providers. Sipgate and
> Sipdiscount. I experience a lot of lost packets on my ADSL connection
> (always have done and there's nothing that can be done about it). The
> lost packets obviously cause some interruption and disconnections of
> VOIP. At G.711A lost packets are obvious and at G.729A/B they are a
> lot less obvious.
>
> I have switched my router to G.729A/B (packet size 10ms) and the
> Sipdiscount account works fine. However, each time a Sipgate call is
> connected, the router switches to G.711A for the duration of the call.
> It's as if Sipgate forces G.711A.
>
> I am trying to find out a work around for this problem as I am
> reluctant to change my router and everyone knows my Sipgate number.
>
> Anyway for force G.729A/B with Sipgate?
>
> Chris
>
I Use G.711u without any problems
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| I'm not sure if they support it.
I use gsm myself, but i dont think many hardware devices support this..
I use asterisk
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| Thomas Kenyon 2006-05-13, 1:11 pm |
| googlegroups@wilsonhughes.co.uk wrote:
> Hi
>
> I am using a Dreytek Vigor 2600VG with two SIP providers. Sipgate and
> Sipdiscount. I experience a lot of lost packets on my ADSL connection
> (always have done and there's nothing that can be done about it).
Sounds strange, if there was nothing that could be done about it, I'd
move to cable. (or in my case to ADSL).
> The
> lost packets obviously cause some interruption and disconnections of
> VOIP. At G.711A lost packets are obvious and at G.729A/B they are a
> lot less obvious.
>
> I have switched my router to G.729A/B (packet size 10ms)
With a 10ms packet size, the packet overhead will be a greater size than
the audio data contained on G.729A/B.
> and the
> Sipdiscount account works fine. However, each time a Sipgate call is
> connected, the router switches to G.711A for the duration of the call.
> It's as if Sipgate forces G.711A.
>
Don't offer it the choice, (assuming you can do this with a 2600VG).
Sipgate do support G.729a, but have 711a, 711u at the start in the
preference order. If your router only offers 729a, then that's what it
will connect at.
> I am trying to find out a work around for this problem as I am
> reluctant to change my router and everyone knows my Sipgate number.
>
> Anyway for force G.729A/B with Sipgate?
>
As with all providers (that I've played with), this needs to be done
with the router.
> Chris
>
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|
<googlegroups@wilsonhughes.co.uk> wrote in message
news:1147521391.456942.127380@i39g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> Hi
>
> I am using a Dreytek Vigor 2600VG with two SIP providers. Sipgate and
> Sipdiscount. I experience a lot of lost packets on my ADSL connection
> (always have done and there's nothing that can be done about it). The
> lost packets obviously cause some interruption and disconnections of
> VOIP. At G.711A lost packets are obvious and at G.729A/B they are a
> lot less obvious.
>
> I have switched my router to G.729A/B (packet size 10ms) and the
> Sipdiscount account works fine. However, each time a Sipgate call is
> connected, the router switches to G.711A for the duration of the call.
> It's as if Sipgate forces G.711A.
>
> I am trying to find out a work around for this problem as I am
> reluctant to change my router and everyone knows my Sipgate number.
>
> Anyway for force G.729A/B with Sipgate?
>
> Chris
>
I have a 2900vg, basically the same router but for cable. Also having the
same problems (but me wanting to use g729 is for bandwidth purposes rather
then packet loss)- no matter what codec I tell it to use, it seems to prefer
to use what sipgate tell it to. I have a grandstream ata aswell and it does
the same. I was planning on asking in the draytek support forum as I think
the device has to be told to insist on using the codec you specify and not
whichever one the provider prefers.
Alex
| |
|
| <googlegroups@wilsonhughes.co.uk> wrote in message
news:1147521391.456942.127380@i39g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> Hi
>
> I am using a Dreytek Vigor 2600VG with two SIP providers. Sipgate and
> Sipdiscount. I experience a lot of lost packets on my ADSL connection
> (always have done and there's nothing that can be done about it). The
> lost packets obviously cause some interruption and disconnections of
> VOIP. At G.711A lost packets are obvious and at G.729A/B they are a
> lot less obvious.
>
> I have switched my router to G.729A/B (packet size 10ms) and the
> Sipdiscount account works fine. However, each time a Sipgate call is
> connected, the router switches to G.711A for the duration of the call.
> It's as if Sipgate forces G.711A.
>
> I am trying to find out a work around for this problem as I am
> reluctant to change my router and everyone knows my Sipgate number.
>
> Anyway for force G.729A/B with Sipgate?
I think you will find you can't, You can only use a codec if it is supported
by both ends, I am pretty sure SIPGate don't support G729
where as Sipdiscount does.
The reason I am guessing is licensing, G711 is an open free codec, G729 is
not and requires a license for each channel, this is why
Asterisk and another of free softphones don't offer G729 codec foc. my guess
is Sipgate calculated it was cheaper to have higher bandwidth bills of
G711 than buy the required licenses
| |
| Thomas Kenyon 2006-05-13, 1:11 pm |
| RH wrote:
> I think you will find you can't, You can only use a codec if it is supported
> by both ends, I am pretty sure SIPGate don't support G729
> where as Sipdiscount does.
Sipgate *do* definately support G.729, there was a small problem for a
short time after they changed the server, but it's been working ever since.
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| Thomas Kenyon 2006-05-13, 1:11 pm |
| Alex wrote:
>
> It seems like they prefer you to use g711, which is why both my devices seem
> to switch to it... which then gets me calls breaking up as I've not got
> enough uploading bandwidth for that and pc usage!
>
>
Sadly, in the negotiaion, they're probably getting priority (not
unreasonably).
If your router can be made to not advertise that it supports other
codecs, you should be fine.
| |
| hairydog@despammed.com 2006-05-13, 7:11 pm |
| On 13 May 2006 04:56:31 -0700, "googlegroups@wilsonhughes.co.uk"
<googlegroups@wilsonhughes.co.uk> wrote:
>I experience a lot of lost packets on my ADSL connection
>(always have done and there's nothing that can be done about it).
I doubt it. I started seeing lost packets, and my ADSL supplier
Eclipse tried to make out that it was at my end, and would do nothing
to investigate. So I switched to Zen. No more lost packets: the
problem was gone immediately, and all I'd changed was the username and
password in the modem/router.
Lost packets could be very bad on VOIP - what if that packet was
telling the call to hang up?
| |
| Darren J Longhorn 2006-05-13, 7:11 pm |
| On Sat, 13 May 2006 21:58:31 +0100, hairydog@despammed.com wrote:
>On 13 May 2006 04:56:31 -0700, "googlegroups@wilsonhughes.co.uk"
><googlegroups@wilsonhughes.co.uk> wrote:
>
>
>I doubt it. I started seeing lost packets, and my ADSL supplier
>Eclipse tried to make out that it was at my end, and would do nothing
>to investigate. So I switched to Zen. No more lost packets: the
>problem was gone immediately, and all I'd changed was the username and
>password in the modem/router.
>
>Lost packets could be very bad on VOIP - what if that packet was
>telling the call to hang up?
I would be repeated due to lack of an ack.
| |
| Chris Blunt 2006-05-13, 7:11 pm |
| On Sat, 13 May 2006 21:58:31 +0100, hairydog@despammed.com wrote:
>On 13 May 2006 04:56:31 -0700, "googlegroups@wilsonhughes.co.uk"
><googlegroups@wilsonhughes.co.uk> wrote:
>
>
>I doubt it. I started seeing lost packets, and my ADSL supplier
>Eclipse tried to make out that it was at my end, and would do nothing
>to investigate. So I switched to Zen. No more lost packets: the
>problem was gone immediately, and all I'd changed was the username and
>password in the modem/router.
>
>Lost packets could be very bad on VOIP - what if that packet was
>telling the call to hang up?
Wouldn't the protocol pick that up within a fairly short period of
time and resend the instruction once it had realised the request
hadn't been acknowledged?
Chris
| |
| googlegroups@wilsonhughes.co.uk 2006-05-14, 7:11 am |
| It's a sad fact around here that due to the length of our aging
telephone lines, uncorrected blocks on ADSL are the norm. Uncorrected
blocks do not usually pose a problem but where you have a lot in
sequence you do suffer lost packets of time sensitive data. If you are
interested my Syslog shows around two million uncorrected blocks a day.
On a good day! In terms of packets lost, it's about 1% of packets
recieved. Unnoticable at G.729A/B but intrusive at G.711A.
Do you think it's just because the Vigor's implementation of G.711A is
poor?
Anyone else have experience of Rx losts?
Chris
| |
| hairydog@despammed.com 2006-05-14, 7:11 am |
| On 14 May 2006 01:26:23 -0700, "googlegroups@wilsonhughes.co.uk"
<googlegroups@wilsonhughes.co.uk> wrote:
>It's a sad fact around here that due to the length of our aging
>telephone lines, uncorrected blocks on ADSL are the norm. Uncorrected
>blocks do not usually pose a problem but where you have a lot in
>sequence you do suffer lost packets of time sensitive data. If you are
>interested my Syslog shows around two million uncorrected blocks a day.
> On a good day! In terms of packets lost, it's about 1% of packets
>recieved. Unnoticable at G.729A/B but intrusive at G.711A.
1% seems a huge percentage to me. What is the SNR margin on your
connection?
What you need to do is to start out by finding how many packets are
being lost. I suggest you open an account at l8nc.com and monitor your
ADSL connection for a while (the Vigor needs to be set to respond to
pings from the internet, of course)
It's probably a good idea to run pathping to some suitable destination
to see where they are being lost.
| |
| Darren J Longhorn 2006-05-14, 7:11 am |
| On 14 May 2006 01:26:23 -0700, "googlegroups@wilsonhughes.co.uk"
<googlegroups@wilsonhughes.co.uk> wrote:
> On a good day! In terms of packets lost, it's about 1% of packets
>recieved. Unnoticable at G.729A/B but intrusive at G.711A.
I don't see why that should always be the case?
| |
|
| hairydog@despammed.com wrote:
> On 14 May 2006 01:26:23 -0700, "googlegroups@wilsonhughes.co.uk"
> <googlegroups@wilsonhughes.co.uk> wrote:
>
>
>
>
> 1% seems a huge percentage to me. What is the SNR margin on your
> connection?
>
> What you need to do is to start out by finding how many packets are
> being lost. I suggest you open an account at l8nc.com and monitor your
Wooo! Yes, everyone talk about l8nc </plug>
> ADSL connection for a while (the Vigor needs to be set to respond to
> pings from the internet, of course)
After much messing around I've got MRTG monitoring various outputs from
my Vigor 2800 (www.letmethink.co.uk/stats). The 'ATM errors (since link
up)' graph is accurate but I'm using the perhour option on the 'ATM
errors graph' so divide by 12 and call the y-axis 'Errored blocks per 5
minutes'. It shows some time of day variation in CRC errors but none of
it is significant enough to cause any packet loss
(http://www.l8nc.com/graph.php?jid=8...86971d485ab11eb).
> It's probably a good idea to run pathping to some suitable destination
> to see where they are being lost.
WinMTR and MTR are pretty good at this sort of thing.
Alex
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| hairydog@despammed.com 2006-05-14, 7:11 pm |
| On Sun, 14 May 2006 22:21:40 +0100, alex <me@privacy.net> wrote:
>It shows some time of day variation in CRC errors but none of
>it is significant enough to cause any packet loss
I can't see any evidence of any packet loss at all.
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