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Home > Archive > Debian Developers > July 2005 > no time for all debian tasks was: interacting with the press
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no time for all debian tasks was: interacting with the press
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| Anand Kumria 2005-07-14, 6:01 pm |
| Hi Torsten,
Thanks for your comments -- however I don't think anyone should be able
afraid to point out when a debian developer is obviously not able to
satisfy all the Debian-related demands on their time; let alone their
committments.
>From <URL: http://www.debian.org/intro/organization> you can various
people listed more than once; in Martin Schulze case 6 times. I've
already said I do not believe that Martin is being an effective press
contact -- good intentions are great, but I'd like tto htink we also
deserve good execution.
Thanks,
Anand
--
`When any government, or any church for that matter, undertakes to say to
its subjects, "This you may not read, this you must not see, this you are
forbidden to know," the end result is tyranny and oppression no matter how
holy the motives' -- Robert A Heinlein, "If this goes on --"
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| Christian Fromme 2005-07-14, 6:01 pm |
| Hello,
Anand Kumria wrote:
> Thanks for your comments -- however I don't think anyone should be able
> afraid to point out when a debian developer is obviously not able to
> satisfy all the Debian-related demands on their time; let alone their
> committments.
First of all, in my opinion your mail never should have gone to -devel,
but only to Martin Schulze and maybe to Branden Robinson.
> people listed more than once; in Martin Schulze case 6 times.
Well, he *does* work hard for Debian, so you should better thank him a
lot for that instead of making (in my opinion) senseless accusations. I
read the article you referenced and I do not agree with you at all.
Christian
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| Olaf van der Spek 2005-07-14, 6:01 pm |
| On 7/14/05, Christian Fromme <kaner@strace.org> wrote:
> Hello,
>=20
> Anand Kumria wrote:
>=20
>=20
> First of all, in my opinion your mail never should have gone to -devel,
> but only to Martin Schulze and maybe to Branden Robinson.
Why can't this be discussed in public? There are probably more people
concerned about this then only him.
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| Greg Folkert 2005-07-14, 6:01 pm |
| On Thu, 2005-07-14 at 17:57 +0200, Olaf van der Spek wrote:
> On 7/14/05, Christian Fromme <kaner@strace.org> wrote:
>
> Why can't this be discussed in public? There are probably more people
> concerned about this then only him.
Initially it is far better to air ones dirty laundry in the privacy of
your own house than out in the Public. Due mainly to the fact of
yellowish stains, brown streaks and in-human smells, or in other words
Bringing to your attention before you embarrass him before a multitude
of people.
If then nothing comes of it, then start the airing publically. There in
lies the rub.
--
greg, greg@gregfolkert.net
For technology that is
Strong, Better, Faster: Linux
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| Florian Weimer 2005-07-14, 6:01 pm |
| * Olaf van der Spek:
>
> Why can't this be discussed in public? There are probably more people
> concerned about this then only him.
It's considered bad style to criticize a person's performance when
they are not available to defend themselves. Debian Developers are
humans, too. The usual standards of courtesy apply. (Surely you
don't expect them to read debian-devel cover-to-cover, which would
only add more load.)
Right now, Debian has some external communication problems, but I can
assure you that discouraging Martin in any way is not part of the
solution.
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| Andrew Suffield 2005-07-14, 6:01 pm |
| On Thu, Jul 14, 2005 at 12:03:00PM -0400, Greg Folkert wrote:
> On Thu, 2005-07-14 at 17:57 +0200, Olaf van der Spek wrote:
>
> Initially it is far better to air ones dirty laundry in the privacy of
> your own house than out in the Public. Due mainly to the fact of
> yellowish stains, brown streaks and in-human smells, or in other words
> Bringing to your attention before you embarrass him before a multitude
> of people.
How exactly do you know that he didn't? Do you read Joey's mail for him?
[That goes for all you other people saying the same thing]
--
.''`. ** Debian GNU/Linux ** | Andrew Suffield
: :' : http://www.debian.org/ |
`. `' |
`- -><- |
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| Greg Folkert 2005-07-14, 6:01 pm |
| On Thu, 2005-07-14 at 21:25 +0100, Andrew Suffield wrote:
> On Thu, Jul 14, 2005 at 12:03:00PM -0400, Greg Folkert wrote:
>
> How exactly do you know that he didn't? Do you read Joey's mail for him?
>
> [That goes for all you other people saying the same thing]
Common Courtesy states that one should also mention personal
communications, even if completely ignored by the person(s) in question.
Even though Anand Kumria mention recent personal conflict with Martin,
this still does nothing in the way of informing us of Netiquette being
properly maintained. It is also not an excuse to cut this part out of
being done period, nor of mentioning it being either way.
Personally, I would have mentioned the dates and times of the
e-mails/phone calls/snail-mails in the preface of the d-d-a list mail.
But, then again, I am not (by far) an average person. I guess I should
*FORCE* myself to have less than respectable expectations for these type
of attacks^Wcriticisms.
And, BTW, How do I know, officially, I don't know if he did or didn't
try to contact Martin. And Yes, I read your e-mail, as well Andrew.
And I too, have been guilty of doing the same thing and have also been
admonished. Why stop now, trying to make d-d or d-d-a more civil, it
would be hard to make less civil, on average.
(of course you know I don't read yours or Martin's e-mail, as this is
"tongue in cheek" mode and is a forever written in stone as a sysadmin
commandment, "thou shalt not read thine users e-mail")
--
greg, greg@gregfolkert.net
For technology that is
Strong, Better, Faster: Linux
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| Brian May 2005-07-15, 2:48 am |
| >>>>> "Greg" == Greg Folkert <greg@gregfolkert.net> writes:
Greg> Common Courtesy states that one should also mention personal
Greg> communications, even if completely ignored by the person(s)
Greg> in question.
Doesn't this also run the risk of making the person look bad?
I guess it depends on how you say it.
"I tried but was unable to resolve this issue via private email."
might be better then:
"I tried contacting XYZ in private but he failed to {respond to my
emails,acknowledge the problem,worship me as his god[1], etc}"
....as the first version doesn't blame XYZ in anyway.
Surely you don't need to provide details what happened?
(note: none of this is specific to anybody mentioned in this thread)
Notes:
[1] Who me? Watch to much Stargate? Never!
--
Brian May <bam@debian.org>
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