On 13 Mar 2006 00:49:46 -0800, "w_tom" <w_tom1@usa.net> wrote:

>  Posted previously was an important concept: 
>
>  To comprehend why, one must understand an electrical concept called
>impedance.  Earthing is essential for transient protection.  Since
>plug-in protectors don't have that earthing connection (too much
>impedance), its manufacturer avoids all discussion about earthing, does
>not discuss the third prong on its power plug, and may only mention
>'ground'.  He hopes that people such as George will confuse wall
>receptacle safety 'ground' with something different: earth 'ground'.

No you are confused.  You're agenda is to discuss the ability for a
plug in surge protector to sustain a direct lightening hit.  But that
is irrelevant to the topic at hand; the likelihood of a HDD to sustain
Electrical damage even when behind multiple layers i.e. best efforts
of electrical protection.  Not solely plug-in products in an
improperly wired building.

>  Meanwhile, real world protector companies discuss earthing, impedance
>created by wires, and other earthing concepts in application notes.  Do
>they discuss their product line?   Since earthing is the most important
>component of a protection system, then Polyphaser discusses earthing
>extensively:
>  http://www.polyphaser.com/ppc_ptd_home.aspx
>
>  'Whole house' protectors from responsible manufacturers provide a
>dedicated earthing wire.  These trustworthy manufacturers include
>Square D, Siemens, Intermatic, Leviton, GE, and Cutler-Hammer.  George
>would have us believe - and without reason - that APC, Tripplite, and
>Belkin are as responsible.   The former sell effective and earthed
>protectors.  The latter make half claims that Curious George distorts
>into myths - such as the third prong on a wall receptacle.  George does
>not understand a basic electrical concept so essential to protecting
>transistors - impedance.  Therefore he speculates that a wall
>receptacle safety ground is an earth ground.

More repetitious regurgitation.  Do you really think "Copy" and
"Paste" are a substitute for logic & argument?

>  What technical facts does George post to refute facts and citations
>from real world protector manufacturers? 
>
>  Posted were numbers that define a minimally acceptable 'whole house'
>protector: at least 1000 joules and 50,000 amps.  George replies with
>this response: 
>        and 

Only you moved comments around to create a brand new post to your own
end.
[vbcol=seagreen]
>  George is typical of those who recommend plug-in protectors and
>insist they know why a disk drive was damaged.  Demonstrated by his own

Utterly clueless.

>posts is a total ignorance of basic electrical concepts and a classic
>'electronics store salesman' grasp of facts.  He does not even know

Pathetically that was your deficit.

>what is and is not grounded inside his computer.  He confuses chassis

you indeed utterly mangled that.

>ground with another and different ground - earth ground. Just more
>reasons why he does not appreciate value of a 'whole house' protector;
>its earthing; and all for protection of a computer, its backup system,
>and everything else inside the house.

I guess you can't read then

>   No earth ground means no effective computer and backup protection.
>Effective protection is why a  'whole house' protector is installed.  A
>less expensive and more effective solution is sold in Home Depot,
>Lowes, and most electrical supply houses.


Since you're obviously smoking your crack pipe whilst regurgitating
the sales pitch you got from Lowes I'll make it crystal clear:

On Sun, 05 Mar 2006 04:22:09 GMT, Curious George <cg@email.net> wrote:

>I don't follow.  When you say glitch I'm thinking you mean a power
>sag, voltage running a little high, or outage.  Those are common power
>glitches.  They do not cause catastrophic loss on healthy hardware,
>esp when a quality UPS is involved.
>
>It sounds like you mean catastrophic surge.  But even then a computer
>with good protection in a well wired building should still not be
>totally fried.

On Mon, 06 Mar 2006 19:43:24 GMT, Curious George <cg@email.net> wrote:

>Certainly not all are equal.  But the point being discussed here is
>whether HDD's can get fried regardless of _any_ attempts of
>protection.

...

>If a lightening strike is reaching the UPS something is wrong IMHO.

...

>A properly grounded building & electrical is a necessity that is
>totally separate from backup.

...

>It is indeed superior.  The Electrical co earths the feed externally
>to the building.  The house & input panel & feed are supposed to be
>grounded as well.  One can even get surge protection at the circuit
>panel/circuit breaker.  Outlets need also be grounded.  By this point
>a UPS's surge capabilities are largely moot.


etc., etc., etc.


The issue is whether a HDD is at significant risk of catastrophic
damage due to power anomalies of any kind regardless of ANY attempts
of protection, especially multiple levels i.e. best efforts of
electrical protection.  With properly wired building & and utility
power a UPS or line conditioner is never taking a direct lightening
hit.  You're missing the mark trying to argue whether plug in
protection is a substitute for properly wired utility power, telco,
buildings, & power panels.  Still, that we agree on ground protection
for direct lightening strikes doesn't mean I can't take exception with
you're exceptionally sloppy terminology, mendacious posturing, &
irrelevant argument.

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