I am a Debian newbie and a fairly new user of Linux although I am very
experienced as a computer programmer. I have downloaded and burned the seven
CD set for Woody. I tried an install from CDROM but ran into a number of
problems, and will try again, after asking these questions here. I did read
the installation notes but they do not answer my questions. Please feel free
to point me to any documentation I missed.

1) I am installing the bf2.4 kernel. When I tried my installation, I tried
'bf24' for the kernel and, while it succeeded, it never seemed to ask for
CD5 afterward which is supposedly where that kernel's files are located. Was
I supposed to install from that CD instead ?

2) A number of screens has a choice of boxes with the ability to choose a
box by having an asterisk placed in the box. I assumed moving the cursor to
the box and hitting the enter key is supposed to choose or remove the choice
for the box. In some situations this worked while in others it did not. What
is the correct way to choose or remove the choice in these screens ?

3) How does one find out what the different packages are ? How does one find
out what the parameters for the packages are ? How does one determine,
amidst the hardware packages, which should be installed for one's own system
?

4) I like the fact that Debian offers a command line interface, if one
chooses, to learn Linux from the command line, but I want to install a
graphical interface also to make things easier for me. How does one do this
? What are the choices between graphical systems ? What packages need to be
installed and in what order ?

Finally, please do not say, 'use Mepis' or some other easier system for
newbies. I want to learn how to do things from scratch, so I have a basic
understanding of Debian. I do have Simple Mepis installed in another
partition, it is very nice, but I want to install Debian at the guts level
and learn it from there also.

Thank you for any information you can give me prior to my attempts to
re-install again.

[ Post a follow-up to this message ]

Hello Edward!

On Sun, 19 Dec 2004 09:56:50 -0500, Edward Diener wrote:
> I am a Debian newbie and a fairly new user of Linux although I am very
> experienced as a computer programmer. I have downloaded and burned the sev
en
> CD set for Woody. I tried an install from CDROM but ran into a number of
> problems, and will try again, after asking these questions here. I did rea
d
> the installation notes but they do not answer my questions. Please feel fr
ee
> to point me to any documentation I missed.
> [...]

Depending on how much you want to learn better be prepared to read a
lot, as quite a few things simply work differently than you might be
used to from another OS.
There is a lot of documentation at
<http://www.debian.org/doc/>
(especially the fine Debian Reference at
<http://www.de.debian.org/doc/user-m...quick-reference> ) as well
as at
<http://newbiedoc.sourceforge.net/>.

Most of the topics you might feel uncertain about right now are being
dealt with.

HTH,
Flo

[ Post a follow-up to this message ]

Florian Ernst wrote:
> Hello Edward!
>
> On Sun, 19 Dec 2004 09:56:50 -0500, Edward Diener wrote: 
>
> Depending on how much you want to learn better be prepared to read a
> lot, as quite a few things simply work differently than you might be
> used to from another OS.
> There is a lot of documentation at
> <http://www.debian.org/doc/>
> (especially the fine Debian Reference at
> <http://www.de.debian.org/doc/user-m...quick-reference> ) as well
> as at
> <http://newbiedoc.sourceforge.net/>.
>
> Most of the topics you might feel uncertain about right now are being
> dealt with.

Thanks for the links, particularly the last !

[ Post a follow-up to this message ]

Hello

Edward Diener (<eddielee_no_spam_here@tropicsoft.com> ) wrote:

> [installed Debian Woody]
>
> 1) I am installing the bf2.4 kernel. When I tried my installation, I
> tried 'bf24' for the kernel and, while it succeeded, it never seemed
> to ask for CD5 afterward which is supposedly where that kernel's files
> are located. Was I supposed to install from that CD instead ?

Kernel 2.4.28-bf2.4 is on both the first CD (where you can choose) and
on the 5th CD (where it is the only one I think). After installation of
the base system, you should also make the kernel known to the package
management, which at that time does not know anything about the
installation kernel. Use

apt-get install kernel-image-2.4.18-bf2.4

Make sure an official Debian Server and the Security Updates site are in
your /etc/apt/sources.list, because there are probably newer kernel
packages with security fixes available.

> 2) A number of screens has a choice of boxes with the ability to
> choose a box by having an asterisk placed in the box. I assumed moving
> the cursor to the box and hitting the enter key is supposed to choose
> or remove the choice for the box. In some situations this worked while
> in others it did not. What is the correct way to choose or remove the
> choice in these screens ?

Maybe try space, of tab.

> 3) How does one find out what the different packages are ? How does
> one find out what the parameters for the packages are ? How does one
> determine, amidst the hardware packages, which should be installed for
> one's own system ?

Install aptitude. Use apt-cache to search the database ob available
packages. Most of the device drivers are already in the kernel package,
so there is no need to install anything else. There are however
exceptions, like lm-sensors and alsa.

> 4) I like the fact that Debian offers a command line interface, if one
> chooses, to learn Linux from the command line, but I want to install a
> graphical interface also to make things easier for me. How does one do
> this ? What are the choices between graphical systems ? What packages
> need to be installed and in what order ?

You should take a look at the installation manual and the Debian
reference, both available as packages and from <http://www.debian.org>.
To install the X window system, use

apt-get install x-window-system-core

Next, choose some window manager or esktop environment. You probably
also want a login manager. E.g. run

apt-get install kde kdm

> Finally, please do not say, 'use Mepis' or some other easier system
> for newbies. I want to learn how to do things from scratch, so I have
> a basic understanding of Debian.

In that case you have to learn to find documentation yourself. There is
plenty available, it is not possible to explain all of your questions
here (and you will have many of them). Go to
<http://www.debian.org/doc> for the beginning. Also check the Linux
Howtos at <http://www.tldp.org>, and use the usenet group search at
<http://www.google.com> (often, you can limit the search to groups like
comp.os.linux.* and linux.debian.*). Most of the questions you have in
the beginning are either answered in the documentation, or you can find
solutions in the usenet archive.

best regards
Andreas Janssen

--
Andreas Janssen <andreas.janssen@bigfoot.com>
PGP-Key-ID: 0xDC801674 ICQ #17079270
Registered Linux User #267976
http://www.andreas-janssen.de/debian-tipps-sarge.html

[ Post a follow-up to this message ]

Andreas Janssen wrote:
> Hello
>
> Edward Diener (<eddielee_no_spam_here@tropicsoft.com> ) wrote:
> 
>
> Kernel 2.4.28-bf2.4 is on both the first CD (where you can choose) and
> on the 5th CD (where it is the only one I think).

This is a little confusing to me. Should I be booting off the CD5 instead if
I want that kernel ? What is on the CD5 which is not on the CD1 ? When the
installation wants a source for further installs of packages, and I tell it
to look at CDROM, should I just be inserting CD5 rather than each of them in
turn ?

> After installation
> of the base system, you should also make the kernel known to the
> package management, which at that time does not know anything about
> the installation kernel. Use
>
> apt-get install kernel-image-2.4.18-bf2.4

OK, thanks

>
> Make sure an official Debian Server and the Security Updates site are
> in your /etc/apt/sources.list, because there are probably newer kernel
> packages with security fixes available.

Thanks again.

> 
>
> Maybe try space, of tab.

I will try space and tab to see if that does the trick.

> 
>
> Install aptitude.

OK, I guess I was trying to figure this out during the initial install so
that I could understand what other hardware packages I need for my
particular hardware. This was the most difficult part for me. While I
realize that the install is automatically picking up the correct packages
for a good deal of my hardware, I could not figure out what had already been
determined and what I had left to do. The install program is not very user
friendly in this regard <g>. I am guessing that installing aptitude comes
after the initial install.

> Use apt-cache to search the database ob available
> packages. Most of the device drivers are already in the kernel
> package, so there is no need to install anything else. There are
> however exceptions, like lm-sensors and alsa.

See comment above.

> 
>
> You should take a look at the installation manual and the Debian
> reference, both available as packages and from
> <http://www.debian.org>. To install the X window system, use
>
> apt-get install x-window-system-core

Good. At least I can do that.

>
> Next, choose some window manager or esktop environment. You probably
> also want a login manager. E.g. run
>
> apt-get install kde kdm

That sound like KDE and the KDE window manager. The installation does not
include this in tasksel as far as I remember so I am guessing that the first
thing to do is to get the X-window system running and then get KDE running
on top of it.

A quick general question about X. If my hardware, such as video adapter and
monitor, is not listed among the choices at installation time, what is the
best way to proceed ? I will check with my hardware vendors and see what
they have that is Linux related for my hardware..

> 
>
> In that case you have to learn to find documentation yourself. There
> is plenty available, it is not possible to explain all of your
> questions here (and you will have many of them). Go to
> <http://www.debian.org/doc> for the beginning. Also check the Linux
> Howtos at <http://www.tldp.org>, and use the usenet group search at
> <http://www.google.com> (often, you can limit the search to groups
> like comp.os.linux.* and linux.debian.*). Most of the questions you
> have in the beginning are either answered in the documentation, or
> you can find solutions in the usenet archive.

Thanks for all the information. I do not mind taking it in steps until I can
figure everything out. For all your good answers, and the fact that the
documentation is generally decent, there is still a large amount that the
documentation does not appear to explain. While you are correct that Google
groups has much information, trying to narrow it down to what one is looking
for is not easy. I know it gets boring dealing with Debian newbies like me
but digging for information to get going is not easy either. I am reading
some Linux books from the past which I have had for awhile, but it sure
would be nice if there were a current one on Debian itself. Any book
recommendations for Linux in general and Debian in particular ? I am a
pretty knowledgable computer user in general so I do not need a simpleton
how-to book by something with as complete as possible technical information
which is well-explained. I am not great at reading large amounts of
documentation online.

[ Post a follow-up to this message ]

Edward Diener (<eddielee_no_spam_here@tropicsoft.com> ) wrote:
> Andreas Janssen wrote:
> 
>
> This is a little confusing to me. Should I be booting off the CD5
> instead if I want that kernel ?

No. Booting from CD 1 and choosing bf24 is sufficient, if it works for
you. I have one compiuter that cannot boot from CD 1, but from CD 5.

> What is on the CD5 which is not on the CD1 ? When the installation
> wants a source for further installs of packages, and I tell it to look
> at CDROM, should I just be inserting CD5 rather than each of them in
> turn ?

No. The base system that you need during installation is not on the
fifth CD, only on CD 1. There are plenty interesting packages on CD 5,
but you can install them after the base system installation is
completed. Just insert CD 5 when the installer/base-config asks if you
have more CDs, or run `apt-cdrom` add later.
 
>
> That sound like KDE and the KDE window manager. The installation does
> not include this in tasksel as far as I remember so I am guessing that
> the first thing to do is to get the X-window system running and then
> get KDE running on top of it.

KDE does not need to be configured by you, installing it should be
sufficient. xfree however needs to be configured properly to run.

> A quick general question about X. If my hardware, such as video
> adapter and monitor, is not listed among the choices at installation
> time, what is the best way to proceed ? I will check with my hardware
> vendors and see what they have that is Linux related for my hardware..

The XFree version in Woody (4.1) is pretty old. Check the documentation
at <http://www.xfree86.org> to see if your card is supported. If your
card is very old and not supported, try Xfree 3.3, which is also
included. If it is too new, either:

- use the VESA driver
- install a driver from the manufactor of the card (e.g. nvidia/ati)
- get a newer version of Xfree, look for it at <http://www.apt-get.org>

> Any book recommendations for Linux in general and Debian in
> particular ? I am a pretty knowledgable computer user in general so I
> do not need a simpleton how-to book by something with as complete as
> possible technical information which is well-explained. I am not great
> at reading large amounts of documentation online.

I have a quite good Debian book, but it is not available in english. I
cannot give you any recommendation on english books (somebody else here
probably can). You should however read the Debian reference from
debian.org, maybe print it if reading it online is to stressful for
you. Another thing you should take a look at is the Securing Debian
Manual.

best regards
Andreas Janssen

--
Andreas Janssen <andreas.janssen@bigfoot.com>
PGP-Key-ID: 0xDC801674 ICQ #17079270
Registered Linux User #267976
http://www.andreas-janssen.de/debian-tipps-sarge.html

[ Post a follow-up to this message ]

Andreas Janssen wrote:
> Edward Diener (<eddielee_no_spam_here@tropicsoft.com> ) wrote: 
>
> No. Booting from CD 1 and choosing bf24 is sufficient, if it works for
> you. I have one compiuter that cannot boot from CD 1, but from CD 5.
> 
>
> No. The base system that you need during installation is not on the
> fifth CD, only on CD 1. There are plenty interesting packages on CD 5,
> but you can install them after the base system installation is
> completed. Just insert CD 5 when the installer/base-config asks if you
> have more CDs, or run `apt-cdrom` add later.

OK, understood.

> 
>
> KDE does not need to be configured by you, installing it should be
> sufficient. xfree however needs to be configured properly to run.

Good to hear that if I get X running properly KDE is easy.

> 
>
> The XFree version in Woody (4.1) is pretty old. Check the
> documentation at <http://www.xfree86.org> to see if your card is
> supported. If your card is very old and not supported, try Xfree 3.3,
> which is also included. If it is too new, either:
>
> - use the VESA driver
> - install a driver from the manufactor of the card (e.g. nvidia/ati)
> - get a newer version of Xfree, look for it at
> <http://www.apt-get.org>

My video adapter is too new for the latest XFree release. I will try the
VESA driver. The only file my manufacturer ( Matrox, P650 ) had related to
Linux was described as a RedHat9 .run file. I have no idea how this works
under Debian or what it has to do XFree. According to what I see on the
XFree86 site the Matrox Parhelia's are not supported in the latest release.
Maybe they will be in the next.

> 
>
> I have a quite good Debian book, but it is not available in english. I
> cannot give you any recommendation on english books (somebody else
> here probably can). You should however read the Debian reference from
> debian.org, maybe print it if reading it online is to stressful for
> you. Another thing you should take a look at is the Securing Debian
> Manual.

Yes, I will have to print it, at least in sections. Thanks again.

[ Post a follow-up to this message ]